{ ha, I got that one right, didn't I? }

[delga]

Ziva David why are you so difficult for me to talk about when I quite obviously WANT to talk about you and your Daddy Issues and what have you. It is possibly more difficult because I've yet to rewatch all of the first half of season 3 again (most of which I blahed through the first time because NCIS and I were having a falling out which led to me leaving the relationship, only to come crawling back when S4 started. I KNOW. I'M SUCH A H0R). I think it is also difficult because I don't have a lot to say, but it feels like I have a lot to say, and possibly I have already said it to twincy who I think is (possibly?) the only person to care.

But you came to us! You came, with your open sexuality, your femslashy vibes with Jenny, your wobbly family history (Daddy Issues and I Shot My Half-Brother Issues included), and your uncomfortable fit into the team. I still maintain that the first episode I felt comfortable watching you in was Frame-Up although I'm certain the re-watch will lead me to think that you were awesome long before then.

Since then, things have happened. You're not an assassin anymore, you don't just kill people willy-nilly (by the way, Jethro is a bastard to you over that, and your Sacrifice is a double-edged blade by the end of S3, which is why it's even more awesome when you go to see him in the finale), you often sport an orange hat and apparently you have a DiNozzo Complex (à la twincy Kate, which, please. Ziva, get a grip. Unrequited Whatever That Is doesn't look good on you). You're still having trouble with those damn idioms, and you're still making mistakes that semantically speaking make no freaking sense. I go through periods of loving that and loathing it, so, we'll see.

So, let's say that season 3 is about finding somewhere to belong in the team and that by 4x01, Shalom, you're fully, actually there (it's not certain in 3x23, Jeopardy, that's for sure, even if fandom would like to think so because the one person who wavers all the way through is Gibbs and Gibbs matters what with him taking on the pater-role) and all debts are paid. Then season 4 must be where you fit the team and you're free to lose some defences. But apparently you gain defensiveness too because, hey, Orange Hat Man and then the Possibly Unrequited Whatever That Is. Gibbs trusts you (by the end of Shalom, that's certain; his 'one-off' return is for you, and you make that point again: a year ago, you would have. Now you know - not better, I don't think, but you do know different. That's not how things work here. That is not acceptable behaviour).

Ah, Shalom. Are debts really repaid? I mean, Jethro says in Hiatus, "I owe you," but if you consider Shalom, that's never equal, is it? It's only equal if Jethro stays in Mexico with HOLA, SENOR MIGUEL and Ziva assumes that it's a one-off thing, that he makes an exception. Except. DUDE. It's not. It's not that at all. ZIVA. HE STILL OWES YOU. And you've felt like you've owed him since Kill Ari Part 2. Two things: (a) you're the only person who Knows before Hiatus and (b) you believe in Ari so fucking much, and you're wrong. So in a way, I don't know because this is stretching it, but in a way, it's almost as if Kate's death - and all associated grief - it's like you take that on yourself. Is this because of Tali? I mean, you were an assassin. Was this before Jenny? Did working with Jenny 'redeem' you? I don't know. I find it sad. (Ari says Gibbs has the unfortunate quality of reminding him of his father. SO FUCKING TELLING if you consider what Ziva reveals only minutes later.) (Not like that isn't obvious, though.) But I wonder, Ziva. I do. Because your Daddy Issues want to transfer and they sort of do (because Jethro simultaneously accepts and rejects her) but they also really don't (because Jethro simultaneously accepts and rejects her).

Anyway, my dilemma is this: I don't know how to write you. If I write backstory, I'm going to be playing with fire. I have no idea what your childhood would have been like. I'm tempted to do it that way anyway, though, because that's where things begin (your father, your God, your sister, your brother). Alternatively, when Jethro arrives (LATE) to Kate's funeral, he tells Jenny that Ziva is escorting Ari's body back to Tel Aviv. Your grief is private, isn't it? And there is both winning and losing in that situation. So that works well, too. I think I can mix it up and play with both halves of that. So.

WHATEVER. Ziva. I'm glad I fell for you. I mean, it was touch and go, what with my leaving and returning and missing vital pieces of information. But here we are.

(Addendum: I love wiki, if only because it reminded me that you boast numerous talents such as a near-photographic memory and the ability to rappel down a cliff without safety ropes. Girl, you hardcore.)

Comments

[fallapartagain.livejournal.com]

And this? Is why I still can't write NCIS without making everyone into blithering idiots. Kudos for the multi-faceted characters, but damn if it doesn't make them so hard to grab hold of!

[delgaserasca.livejournal.com]

I know! I've decided that I'm never ever going to write Gibbs, even though he's easily the most interesting character (in terms of his past, his personality, his secrets) because I would frak it up.

One day I'll do a Gibbs meta post but that will be long. Longer than this Ziva one. It will also likely piss people off, so I'm reluctant.

Also: HI! *hugs*

[fallapartagain.livejournal.com]

See, so far, I'm finding Gibbs reasonably easy, but I think I may be grasping only one aspect of him. This is my problem, see, they're so multi-faceted that it's hard to grasp all sides at once, especially when you can't see the full picture because you don't actually know it. It frustrates me so much. It frustrates me to the extent of being so tempted to go and hurt something.

I had a couple of NCIS fics going but I've abandoned them upon discovering that, actually? I can't write McGee to save my life. I think, after Kate, he's the hardest.

[delgaserasca.livejournal.com]

Hee, I find Kate pretty straight-forward, actually. I can see the things she wants, I can see the way she thinks, and I know the way she acts. But the others? For one, I can't get Abby's dialogue down. I get the character but I feel like I'm missing something. Gibbs... I always feel like he's the guy you're never going to understand because he's fifty people all at the same damn time and he has History and he's Secretive and I think secretly he's wanted the same thing all his life (i.e. normality, a wife, a family) and never really been able to get it together since Shannon and Kelly died. So in a way, I do understand parts of him. But I can't write him because he surprises me in a lot of ways. (Like in the episode where Jenny is kidnapped and the guy dies in the elevator: in the episode, Jethro's reaction to Ziva sort of makes sense. In the history of the show... it doesn't. Jethro doesn't hold up for Ziva the way he does for McGee in Probie. But he also owes her for Ari. So. I don't know why he acts the way he acts, or what makes him mistrust Ziva.)

I think McGee is much more complex than he is made out to be at times.

[fallapartagain.livejournal.com]

I think Gibbs has an element of pretty much everyone in the show, past and present. Plus, he has his own character too, which kinda throws you completely.

And McGee is so much more complex than they want you to believe. I think he, too, has a small element of many of the others.

They're all onions. NCIS: The Onion Show.

[delgaserasca.livejournal.com]

Hahahaha!

Someone needs to draw that, heh.

[twincy.livejournal.com]

*frowns unconvincingly* (Ha, I have no Tony icon. How about that?)

I'll have to come back to this at a later date, when I can focus on it. I can't quite grasp what you're getting at here, but I'm sure it's a problem on my end.

[delgaserasca.livejournal.com]

I... don't really know what that first sentence means.

It was really more my trying to sum up Ziva's S3 and S4 emotional arcs than anything else. I'm not certain I was successful, though.

[twincy.livejournal.com]

You (almost) said I had DiNozzo complex, and yet, I fail to be annoyed, is what it meant.

Well, okay. You are made of wordiness and meta this week, evidently.

[delgaserasca.livejournal.com]

lolz, okay. (But... you sort of do?)

I know. Also, I was being super vague in parts because I was worried about spoiling people. I don't know why though.

[twincy.livejournal.com]

I assure you: my feelings towards DiNozzo are far from complex. (Punning aside, they kind of are, because there's no logical reason why I don't hate his guts. Oh boy, you're right. I'm totally like Ziva: logically, you should not be attracted to him, and yet, you are.)

(... second person narrative is so damn contagious.)

(... and now I want to reread Bright Lights, Big City, as everything is making me want to read something these days.)

[delgaserasca.livejournal.com]

*laughs* *not unkindly, though*

(It really is. Have you written fic in second person? So much fun.)

(I. Okay.)

[twincy.livejournal.com]

(I haven't. Sometimes I want to, but then I remember that a lot of people don't like to read it, and I chicken out. The other day [on the bus in A.? - if I close my eyes I can see what I was looking at when I was thinking about it; yay, memory, well done] I was thinking about doing a poll on POV preferences and whether fic being written in anything but third person POV makes people reluctant to read it.)

(... is this another one of those books I assume you know when you really don't? Bright Lights, Big City is a novel by Jay McInerney written in second person POV. The thing with 2nd p POV is that it's sticky, so after finishing the book I kept narrating things to myself - "You pour yourself a cup of tea, reaching into the cabinet for sugar" etc. Irritating? Yes.)

[delgaserasca.livejournal.com]

(It would be an interesting poll in and of itself, but I don't like the idea of it so much because of the impact it could have on how many people then use 2nd person narration.)

(Okay. I imagine reading second person for a long period of time can be annoying [because there's a lot of direct instruction] but it sounds like an interesting text. re: self-narration - lolz. I think I've told you this before but anyway, in her journals, Plath wrote in second person. !)

[twincy.livejournal.com]

(Considering the size of my f'list/the general amount of people who give a damn about I post, I doubt it'd have much impact. And what if it ends up having a positive impact? Now I'm in the mood to host a mini Non-standard POV ficathon, though. Also I'm in the mood to watch the bar scenes from the last episode of Raines, but that's another matter altogether.)

(It's not annoying, but it sucks you very deep into the story. I've mentioned my difficulties with letting go of fictional universes after I've finished the canon, and this is another one that lingered for a long time. The book weighs next to nothing; I could package it with the Judith Guest? I think I will - it's a pretty extraordinary book, and it matches Ordinary People in theme as well as tone.)

I've never had that problem, or, if I have, I've never noticed. Now I'm worried that I've been missing things, aie.

[delgaserasca.livejournal.com]

(re: positive impact, I thought about that just after I posted but it depends on the definition, doesn't it? More 2nd person fic isn't necessarily a great thing. Speaking of non-standard, there's a comm that's based on the idea of style, not fandom or pairings. I'll try to find it for you. I haven't joined because fic challenges kill me, but I'm looking forward to reading some of the fic. )

(I just realised that the fic you beta'd for me was second person. Anyway: huzz! Sounds good. I'm totally going to parcel up the two I'm sending you right now because otherwise I'll forget. Also, I'm supposed to be watching 10 minutes of a film because Mark Harmon is in it but The Dad is currently watching the news so I'll have to go down a bit later.)



It's my day at moresound tomorrow except I've barely listened to iTunes in the past fortnight. Sigh.

Oh, that sounds like Dad. Back in ten.

[twincy.livejournal.com]

(Making people more aware of the stylistic choices they make - or don't make, as the case may be - is a good thing, though. The comm sounds interesting; I hope you find it. aurelia_priscus has them all uploaded to MegaUpload, I think? The links should be in her journal somewhere.)

(I didn't even remember that, heh. I need padded envelopes! And scales. Or, ooh, brown wrapping paper, but I can't find that anywhere. I tend to keep envelopes/wrapping paper from things people send me because I like the different paper textures to write/draw on. I'm a bit of a paper geek. Re: Mark Harmon's hair: is this before he went gray? I can see how that would be disconcerting.)

I still need to download things from your last music post, but I hadn't the disk space until today, and now I do but Windows is pretending I don't. Fed up with this PC, yo. /broken record.

How was the film?

[delgaserasca.livejournal.com]

(Again: I don't know. I mean, I read a lot of stylistically normal and stylistically different stuff, so I can't tell you where my reservations are seeded. But they're there. )

(I used to keep paper but it got annoying after a while. The Rents sell brown paper in theore so I don't have to (a) pay for it, yay or (b) remember to pick it up from the post office, huzz. re: Harmon, YES. As in, 1991. As in the year my sister was born. )

Good thing you said so; I was about to yank said content.

DID NOT SEE. DAD DOES NOT UNDERSTAND MY INNERFANGIRL, OBVS.

[twincy.livejournal.com]

p.s. This site says:

While the second-person point of view exists, it is not used very often because making the reader part of the story can be awkward: "You walk to the end of the road and pause before heading towards the river."

Which I find to be bullshit.

Randomly: would you be willing to put up with Harry Potter fic if it were stylistically interesting?

[delgaserasca.livejournal.com]

Well, depends on how adept the writer is, right? Beause a whole run of those sentences could get really boring. But 2nd POV really doesn't work thatw ay when successful? But making it successful is the trick, I guess. Hey - you could drabble? (This being re: you want to but haven't?)

I've read loads of HP fanfiction. I find some of it superior to the source.

[twincy.livejournal.com]

Well, yes, but the site suggests that second person POV is something silly and stinted, which isn't true. I brandish my love for Bright Lights like a weapon, verily. I could indeed drabble! The thought terrifies me, but then, I need to get over myself re: writing.

I wasn't sure if you'd even read the source, but in that case:
To The Lighthouse. Yes, it's what you think it is.

p.s. Have downloaded the soundtrack offering, in case you were waiting for that?

[twincy.livejournal.com]

Stunted, jesus. *glares at English language* I COULD STILL SWITCH COURSES YOU KNOW. IT ISN'T TOO LATE.

[delgaserasca.livejournal.com]

Stinted works?

v.tr.
To restrict or limit, as in amount or number; be sparing with.

[twincy.livejournal.com]

But it's not what I meant.

[delgaserasca.livejournal.com]

*shrugs* It actually makes more sense, though? Not the meaning I quoted, but still.

re: your address, found it, huzz! re: package, packaged! re: me, totally going to sleep now. !

Talk tomorrow(-ish).

[delgaserasca.livejournal.com]

Ah. Well then: arsehole. (Write a drabble, yo.

Ooh, I think I've read stuff by this author before.

Oh. No, I wasn't. But thanks :)

[twincy.livejournal.com]

Oh, ha ha. (Pretending to be mock-amused when you really are amused: mock-mock-amused?)

(Don't tempt me, Meish, I'm not nearly drunk enough.)

[delgaserasca.livejournal.com]

(I CAN'T BELIEVE YOU JUST. !!! YOU.)

[twincy.livejournal.com]

(I just laughed aloud, aie. Good thing the roommate's bedroom is on the other side of the apartment.)

(*grins viciously*)