{ still on my NCIS fest. }

[delga]

"Once in a blue lagoon."

HAHAHAHAHAHAHA. Oh Ziva. Now I KNOW you're just fucking with them.

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If any of you are surprised that there will be upcoming ZIVA META then you're fired.

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edit: TELL ME that the Bones episode wasn't called The Pain in the Heart! THAT IS HORRIBLE.

Comments

[daygloparker.livejournal.com]

Oh. Oh, yes it was.

:(((((((((

[delgaserasca.livejournal.com]

Way to ride the cliché boat, Bones peeps! HORRIBLE.

[atlashrugged.livejournal.com]

I've always thought Ziva's malapropisms are intended to be off-putting. I just don't see people intentionally making those kind of mistakes with English.

I loved when Gibbs gave her that knife in Internal Affairs and she had that look of odd enthusiasm on her face.

I have plans tonight and may wait until tomorrow to watch the finale.

[atlashrugged.livejournal.com]

Well, it is so much like fanfic already.


I just realized I missed your huge Bones post somehow.

[delgaserasca.livejournal.com]

I can't believe it's the finale already (hence trying to catch up at the moment).

You can tell it's been a while since I've seen an episode though because everything fills me with inordinate amounts of glee, heh.

[grimorie.livejournal.com]

I totally get your Ziva love now and I've only seen 3 episodes with Ziva in it: Kill Bill, the episode she joined NCIS and the recent episode where she went undercover.

TELL ME that the Bones episode wasn't called The Pain in the Heart!

Um. Okay, I won't.

...

It really is horrible. Oh, Bones.

[delgaserasca.livejournal.com]

Yeah, I haven't seen the most recent undercover one yet! But Kill Ari, to me, is a really important episode, especially the very end of it. Oh. Oh. I talk about that episode a lot.

This is not to say that I do not have an overwhelming love for Kate. But yes. I do have many things to say about Ziva.

[grimorie.livejournal.com]

especially the very end of it. Oh. Oh. I talk about that episode a lot.

Oh, man, I know! That was when things shifted for me. Like you, I have an overwhelming love for Kate, it's one of the reasons why it took me so long to watch the episodes after Kate and longer to warm up to the idea of Ziva but when I finally saw it (and coming I've already heard rumors of her awesome) I went from: 'Hmm... she's okay' to 'OMG, did they really? Did she... OMG!'

Honestly, goner right then.

So now I'm trying to find all the relevant Ziva episodes so I can catch-up to her character.

Oh, and the other thing that made me love Ziva? She understood more than anyone that she isn't there to replace Kate because she *isn't* Kate. Kate is Kate and Ziva is Ziva.

[delgaserasca.livejournal.com]

I love how they tied Ziva into the story as a whole. Ziva is part of Kate's story, whether Kate was conscious of it or not. The Ari arc ends with Ziva, though she's been a spectre most of the way through.

But my god, she's so... her strength is so different. Her mind is so different. Her grace is so different. And her connection to Jethro (professionally; I'm not a shipper) is so pervasive. So much of Ziva's story in the past few seasons has been linked to Jethro's story and vice versa. She is so complex and yet, I think, also very straight forward in a lot of ways.

OK, seriously, I have to finish watching this otherwise I'll get stuck into pre-emptive Ziva talk! I've been considering making a Ziva tag on lj, but if you follow my NCIS tag (http://delgaserasca.livejournal.com/tag/ncis.), I'm sure you'll work out how verbose I am, lols.

[grimorie.livejournal.com]

. Ziva is part of Kate's story, whether Kate was conscious of it or not.

I never thought of it that way but you're very right, Ziva is part of Kate's story because of that.

The reveal about Ari and right after Ziva did what she did stunned me and completely threw Ziva in a new light. She knew what Gibbs wanted her to do, knew the possibility of what she has to do and yet she did it because it was the right thing to do. And it was just... oh, Ziva.

She managed to make her way up my to 15 female characters and I think, if I saw more I think she'd climb up the charts more, even right after Dani Reese even!

I'm sure you'll work out how verbose I am, lols.

Hee. I completely understand this, especially coming from my Dani Reese love (my love for Reese completely blindsided me, it's kind of freaky).

BTW, would you have any Ziva recommended episodes?

[delgaserasca.livejournal.com]

Yeah, but here's the thing, it wasn't just about what Gibbs wanted her to do. It was about Ziva's perception of the truth and ultimately it's what she knew she had to do. And that's what makes teh Ziva&Jethro relationship so interesting because they work within the same morality code. He never specifically asks her to kill Ari; he asks her to bear witness to Ari's confession. Except Ari is more of a danger than that and Ziva is forced into this impossible situation. And for Ziva - her world has just been transformed. Her brother, whom she loves, has just been revealed a traitor. And thus she can never go home to her father, who adored his son. The balance there is never complete. She comes to America because that's where she's left. There is no place for her in Tel Aviv. (And that's why the end of S3 is so damn important, too, because that's the moment where Jethro finally, goddammit, finally properly acknowledges what Ziva did. It's so implicit all the way through S3, but his distrust of her - also implicit, through her connection to Ari - is ridden right up to the penultimate episode of the season [a Ziva episode] where it seems the distance between Ziva and Jethro is so long, then bam, the finale and Ziva's pivotal role in that. (Not to mention her pivotal role in 4x01, Shalom. Another episode which I talk buckets about.)

Ah, I don't know. There are Ziva-centric episodes but I'm not really someone who quick-fixes shows, so really, to get a true idea of her, you do have to go beyond the bog standard episodes. That said, 3x04, Silver War is her first episode with the team, and that's pretty important. Then there's nothing specific until the very end of the season - Jeopardy and Hiatus 1&2. 1x04 Shalom is a must and 4x16 (?) Dead Man Walking. There aren't really many character-centric episodes, but those are the big ones. But seriously, it's much better if you just watch through the series. Showcase episodes tell you very specific things about characters, but then they miss all the subtle parts. (Oh, also I guess 5x12, Tribes is important, too, but the message is a bit anvilly in that one. And then the one you saw most recently.)

[grimorie.livejournal.com]

Oh, ooh all interesting thoughts, especially Jethro and Ziva. I like how complicated their relationship is, even just seeing a few episodes I can already see that. Jethro doesn't trust her when she first joins NCIS, he takes away her weapons just so he can make it clear he understands how she'd work (or at least that's what I took from the scene).

I'll follow your advice, I'll mainline NCIS, I'm so fascinated with her character. More so now that you've explained how twisty her relationship with Jethro really is.

[delgaserasca.livejournal.com]

Her relationships with the other characters are interesting, too (oh, Abby; and of course, Jenny Sheppard - I have LOTS to say about that later, actually) but yeah, for me, because she and Jethro are my favourite characters, that's where my focus lies.

There's this huge emphasis on moving away from Ziva the Assassin, and a lot of that is on Jethro's part. Because I think part of his wariness stems from the fact that she killed her brother (so in a sense, she's ruthless). But. Well. He's wrong and he does work that out. Eventually. He takes away her weapons to force her to think, which she can do - he just wants to see how far her mind measures up to her physical skill.

There are other super things! Like: Tony and Jenny Sheppard! There is Tony and Ziva weirdness that I'm not really behind but they totally just redeemed that in the last episode I watched. There is McGee and Jethro and those few instances where Jethro is totally the bigger man. AND. AND AND AND. Oh my. Tobias Fornell and MIKE FRANKS who you will meet at the end of S3. I love Mike Franks.

OK. Seriously. Stopping now. lols.

[grimorie.livejournal.com]

No, really, it's all very interesting. It's nice to 'hear' fans so enthusiastic about their shows. Also, I love reading meta so reading this wasn't a hardship at all.

I've only seen the recent undercover episode after the episode where Ziva joined up so Tony acting that way toward Ziva was pretty confusing.

So many things you've mentioned here, I definitely need to catch up!